/ 21 November 2008

Against all odds

Two months into his new job as ANC chair in the Western Cape, Mcebisi Skwatsha is confident that, on his watch, the ANC will win the province in the next election. Since he was elected the party has haemorrhaged members to Mbhazima Shilowa and Mosiuoa Lekota’s Congress of the People (Cope). The ANC also faces at least 20 by-elections because councilors have defected to Cope. Pearlie Joubert interviewed him:

Q: You were elected Western Cape ANC chairman with about 40% of the branches staying away. What is the state of the organisation you inherited?
A: The ANC is facing a lot of challenges currently. We’ve observed so many things that we’ve never seen before, like people burning ANC T-shirts, like people tearing up their membership cards. Shikota (Congress of the People) are claiming they’ve taken 14 000 of our members. We have a record of only 14 resignations. But more people are resigning, and some are being fired.

Q: Are you taking these resignations seriously or are you macho about it, dismissing those resigning as ‘counter-revolutionaries”?
A: We’re very serious about what’s happening in the province. We tasked our organisng department to prepare a state-of-the-branches document for us so we can have a clear picture of the strengths and weaknesses in all our branches. This committee will specifically look at troubled branches like Phillipi, Hout Bay, Drakenstein (Paarl region) and a couple of others.

Q: You must be very worried about Cope — they’ve pulled big crowds in the Cape. ANC president Jacob Zuma’s visit to the province [two weeks ago] pulled only about 4 000 in Gugulethu — more or less the same number of people as the breakaway party.
A: Strangely I’m not worried about Shikota. There’s not a chance in hell that they will donner us in the Western Cape. We have 20 by-elections coming up in early December as a direct result of resignations by councillors to join Shikota. Come voting day, you will see how strong the ANC in the province is. I have no fear and I’m not worried. And it’s bullshit — excuse my language — that only 4 000 people attended Zuma’s meeting. We filled the stadium. The disaster management people will tell you that there were close to 20 000 at the rally.

Q: I don’t believe you. Most political analysts and members of the opposition parties are saying that the ANC can kiss the province goodbye. The internal divisions in the organisation have plagued the province for many years.
A: I have to say this once and for all: It’s with a sigh of relief that we watch these people leaving to join Shikota. It’s actually a blessing in disguise. A lot of these people have been ready to collude with the DA. Is Shikota not simply a black DA, you must ask yourself. You need to know that Helen Zille is today the mayor of Cape Town because of the actions of ANC people. Now with those who were not committed to the ANC out of the way, we have the space to build unity. I rather remain with ten loyal ANC members than 100 snakes.

Q: Ja, well, ten loyal members will not bring you power at the ballot box —
A: We are going to win this province. President Jacob Zuma said so. I say so. You can insult Skwatsha. You can insult Zuma. But what these Shikota people haven’t realised yet is that the voters will turn against them because they’re bent on destroying the ANC. The ANC is people’s heritage. Shikota has crossed a line and all the old activists are saying to us that they’re coming back and standing up against this terrible destruction of our organisation. The by-elections of 10 December will be the real test.

Q: The DA is absolutely confident about pocketing the province in next year’s election …
A: Oh no, they’re not! Zille is confident about coalitions.

Q: Why don’t you talk coalition politics and make a deal with Cope? Will you consider it?
A: We can’t talk about a coalition with a party that doesn’t even have a manifesto! It’s way to premature to talk about a coalition with a party when we don’t know who and what they are. We’re only interested in getting 50% plus one. Since 1994 the ANC did better in each election. We started off with 43% in 2004 we got 46%.

Q: But you know who joined Cope in the Cape — it’s all the members excluded from the congress and the councillors you’ve sacked.
A: Shikota is a conglomeration of everybody who was corrupt in the province. They’re a conglomeration of everyone who was scandalous and who were, frankly speaking, undesirable. Among Shikota’s leaders now are people who committed fraud; who were expelled for being criminals. You will see that most of their members are inspired by their desire to get their hands in the till and ironically Comrade Terror knows exactly how disgusted he was with the actions of some of the people who have now joined him.

Q: Talking of hands in the till: what are your business interests in the province?
A: I own ten mobile toilets together with a friend of mine. That’s it. That’s all. The media, including the Mail & Guardian, have accused me of being a beneficiary of a security company; of being improperly involved in the sale of land. If ten mobile toilets, amounts to putting my hands in the provincial till, then please print that.

Q: Do you think that the ANC, through a controversial provincial conference process, has driven people away and into the arms of Cope?
A: Our own divisions have not helped. We need to get our house in order. We’re very serious about winning this province, for the first time, next year. Cape Town needs to join the rest of South Africa. We’ve observed that most of the people who are right-wing leaning and still hang on to the kragdadigheid (strong-arm) policies of the past live here. People think that the Cape is the last bastion of colonialism. We have to take this province.

Q: Are you saying that the people here are rightwing because the ANC doesn’t manage to get a majority vote here?
A: Of course. The ANC has the best policies.

Q: Has the national ANC leadership prioritised the Cape because it’s the only province the ANC can’t win?
A: Yes absolutely. In terms of resources and deployment of leaders, the Western Cape is a priority.

Q: More than half the voters in the Cape are coloured. As a block the ANC doesn’t have their support. Why would next year be different?
A: Come walk with me through the Flats and I will show you the support I have among coloured voters. I am not an African leader. I’m an ANC leader and my role is to try and unite not only the organisation but also the province.