Judge Davis irked by JSC questions about Hlophe

"Davis explained that he had been training to climb Mount Kilimanjaro for two years and had booked his ticket by the time he found out the date of the conference."

LOL!!

which conference??????

The question is: was it a fair question to ask Judge Davis? Certainly not; but in the racially charged South African atmosphere such questions become relevant.

As a private citizen I want to have the right to tell a white guy to get off when he tramples my toes without being accused of racism. And equally I want him to tell me so without fear of being accused of racism.

The racism thing has been trivialised in the South African media discourse. Racism is about institutional power used to humiliate, exclude, other people on the basis of their race. When you crossed race laws in the past, you could be punished and go to jail. Racism was defended in the court room, on the pulpit, and socially ... if you insisted to be served in a Wimpy and you were black, the manager simply called the police.... the whole state power was used to uphold racism and crush you!

Now that was the racism Mandela fought against; institutional racism supported by state power (violence) and white guys spent talents and brain power designing public signage,urban plaaning, administrative forms for govt departments, laws, and etc to ingenously exclude non-white people. It subjected people to humiliation, degradation of their dignity, and kept them out.

It was no revelation to read on a Sunday newspaper an editor arguing that some people were created by God from left over mud (in Genesis) meaning white mud was for used for true human beings the real Adam first and as an after thought God created some subhumans. These issues were debated publicly at afrikaner political rallies to much applaud by whites who have conveniently forgotten.

Now, if I work at the Cape Chambers as a judge and I tell some white colleague to get off; the question is: is there some institutional power that I am using to generally humiliate, degrade and exclude my white colleagues? for racism to stick it had to apply generally, backed by establishment power and based on race. If I do it once does it colour me for life as a racist?

So if at a shop the attendant decides to ignore me and serve a white person, I simply walk out and spend my money elsewhere. If my 3 year old plays with a white 3 or 4 year old in a shop and the white mum decides to pull her child away, I simply ignore it. These are incidents that will always be there. We cant take them to newspapers and make issues out of them.

But if Nathi Cele gets powers to arrest and detain white teenagers for criticisng Zuma, and black judges suddenly come to the conclusion that they are to blame for their own deaths while in police detenion then we have a massive racial problem in South Africa. And I know which side I will be fighting on.

We seem to decontextualise racism in South africa. The ANC govt has problems of corruption and incompetence but it comes nothing near to the criminal excesses of the Apartheid govt and its racial incompetence.

How many white mothers can live with the experience of going to the police mortuary to identify a deceased teenage son and be subjected to the spectacle of black police bragging about which one they shot and at what close range when they pull out the trays? Most black mothers went through that experience and to their credit they are willing to extend the hand of friensship to white people generally.

But there is something cheap about white people generally trying very hard to equate this government with some standard of BADNESS. I sincerely welcome their criticism and opinions and right to say what they feel, but there is something wrong with a standard of morals which equates thieves with murderers and ask for the same justice.

It is pointless to fight every form of petty "racism" and it debases and trivialises the whole gamut of institutional humiliation that black people went through in South Africa during Apartheid.

It is racist to say that all white judges are competent. What about those who hardly sent a white guy for the murder of a black guy in the 100 year history of white rule? Instead we have been treated to the spectacle of beer mixed with cought mixture as a mitigating factor. How do we agree to capital punishment to come back when these guys have hardly come clean about that...?

There are two sides to a story. We need to be objective and truly listen to what makes whites afraid. We need to involve them not as a favour but because we genuinely wish to create a just society. And we need to listen to Mandela and live out all the values he stands for. we need to release judges to do what they know best and that it to apply laws and judge cases. Whatever Hlophe does in there he hardly asks all blacks generally in South Africa. he is his own man.

In our efforts to pull down every black man because of fear of the black man,we will squander our capital for racial tolerance, and goodwill.

The mattter between Hlophe and Nkabinde was about Zuma; it is telling to remember that it had nothing to do with racism. But in our messianic zeal to battle racism windmills, it simply metamorphrosed into racism. How? That's a reading of our racial barometer and that's how toxic the racial demon can become!

Dennis Davis lectured me at UCT between 1976 and 1978, was a thoroughly impressive anti-apartheid man back then, before it became fashionable or the easy choice. Because I attended his lectures I have followed his progress since then and can only wish him the best. He is a thoroughly upstanding man, the likes of whom who should represent ALL South Africans at the Con Court. He is a giant of a man! (no humour or sarcasm intended)

he racism thing has been trivialised in the South African media discourse. Racism is about institutional power used to humiliate, exclude, other people on the basis of their race

This is one funny country. When a black person speaks out against a white person, he is branded a racist. When a white person does the same thing and we brand him a racist, then white peolpe start crying foul. you will hear arguements that the white person is a scholar or so forth. These white folks must get off their high horse and accept that a black man is in charge of the country. They should be happy we did not go the Zimbabwean road. When ever a black person is appointed to a high position they are judged even before they start their work(bheki cele). When Mara Ramos and Gill Marcus were appointed to power not one sceptical report was published. Maybe the whites should go and stay in another country where black wont be a nuisance to them.

Marvin old chap. Who lied to you that the black man is in charge in RSA? In a democracy power is shared within and among social groups, including political parties, social bodies, churches, classes, etc. The ANC dominates but has no complete political power. It doesn't dominate commerce, which is largely, but not wholly, in white hands. Blacks fill stadiums to listen to political speeches because they need the patronage to get jobs, while whites network at Newscafe. Justice Hlophe is one sorry case of a black man who uses political connectivity and Zulu-ethnocentricity to lord it over us. He is manipulating race and the victim card to drive a personal ambition. He is part of a pack of self-seeking wolves made up of black advocates, judges and JSC members who coalesce around the Zuma cult for power.

Look to your leaders for the cause of this apparently deepening divide between black and white in SA! (I say apparently because it seems to me that more and more of these debates end up as racial accusations and slurs, public and private).

Go back to the mid nineties ... South African and the world in general were optimistic and positive about our future, there was a strong 'camaraderie' evident throughout the country ... people, black and white, believed in our future. 'Racism' was a word seldom used and even less seldom in a headline.

We had a true statesman as a leader ... we all believed he represented everything that was good and positive for our future.

What have we had since?
Headline after headline reporting corruption, nepotism and ineptitude.
A system of wealth redistribution that favours the 'connected' and the 'corrupt' and the 'selected' but that leaves the mass of 'disadvantaged' no better off.
Hardship lavished on the population by incompetent politicians and their cronies.
Endless proof of wrongdoings and greed by leaders who are never brought to book.
An failed education system.
A failed security system.
A failed health care system.
A government that endlessly fails to deliver.
A judiciary mashed and beaten to a pulp.
Massive controversy surrounding the ethics of our President.
A leader of the ruling party's youth league who has uttered more racial slurs and hate speech than the rest of the nation combined, as is still allowed to spread his poison.
etc etc etc.

And when white SA's criticise this they are labelled racists, when black SA's criticise this they are disenfranchised.

The criticism you read daily in the press has nothing to do with racism ... it is the reaction of a nation grieving over a future destroyed by incompetence, greed and corruption - immaterial of committed by black or white.

It starts right at the top and seeps through our culture like the virus it is.

You and I accusing each other of intolerance and hatred and racism does nothing to help and will certainly not change a thing, quite the contrary ... and all it does is play into the hands of those mindless buffoons hell bent on their own fame and fortune.

Gauta, Marvin & Mandla,

The saddest thing I hear from you are all the generalisations like, "most black mothers", "commerce..... in white hands", black person....judged before they even start". In the spirit of Steve Biko where is your intellectual pride that you cannot see past this race card. Black people are in charge of every sphere of government (although this is as a numerical majority but many in charge are useless cadre deployments, black and white (Erwin, Slovo & Hanekom come to mind). Black people run commerce in SA, the value and turnover of SAA, Transnet, Eskom, ARM, etc outstrip businesses where white ownership is proven by miles. The PIC must be the biggest institutional investor in SA listed companies (where the race of the shareholders cannot be determined). Affirmative action is institutionalised in many forms to benefit black people. Black people must be the majority of consumers by value.

Surely with this power you do not need to fear criticism and fall back on the race card without addressing actual issues. I believe the race issue was fired up by Thabo Mbeki to deflect valid criticism from what his incompetent, corrupt and downright lazy political appointees were doing (or not doing). This was (and remains) an insult to black people and surely SA needs to rather choose the Biko route of black pride.

Now, do you really think Hlope is the best candidate?

Davis: Judges should not be in newspapers!

Oh, and they should be on TV ne, yeah right!!!!!!!

by no means am i saying black africans are innocent of racism. what i am saying is that everytime a black person does something the has to be an outcry from people like Kriegler. The only reason whites network at newscafe is because they control our stolen wealth. We are never given a chance to do anything without critisicm. Even the so called great administrater like Maria ramos have left transnet in a mess. Even Anglo could't appoint a black chairpeson. Whites are only clever than us because they had goog education, but even with our little education we have made something of ourselves. Take the guy who is about to be the CEO of firstRand.

Gauta Komane,

Why are you adopting a black pseudonym when we can clearly see the colour of your politics. Let me quickly pick a bone with this racist rubbish;

"Blacks fill stadiums to listen to political speeches because they need the patronage to get jobs, while whites network at Newscafe"

Haven't you realised that apartheid stripped blacks of their dignity and left them as poor as chucrh mouses. They don't have money to network, let alone at NewsCafe nogal. You can go there and spend your ill-gotten wealth - the blacks don't have money hence they go to stadiums to network and be fed at the same time.

This insensitivity is all over the place. For someone who benefitted at the expense of blacks and brag about it is childish and plain stupid........

We know who is rich in this country!!! We know how they became rich!!! We know how blacks came to be this destitute!!! We know who networks at NewsCafe!!! We know who attends political rallies!!!

What we don't know is;

How is it possible after killing and maiming blacks people can still brag about. How is it possible that after dispossesing blacks in their own country, Europeans still do not acknowledge those atrocities visited on the natives. How is it that the likes of Gauta Komane find joy and satisfaction in this sad state of affairs.